I have just been informed that there is a church that is including Santa in their Christmas Play. This seems a little odd to me. I don't recall anywhere in the bible where it talks about santa, can you? And anyway, arn't we celebrating the birth of Jesus? Does this seem like a bad idea to anybody else? I just think that a church that believes in Jesus should push the fact that Christmas is about Jesus.
Believe it or not many christians don't see a problem with a Santa Claus or a Easter Bunny figure. I tend to disagree...a lot! I would say that 99% of the time when the ACLU would agree with a church, that is a bad thing. I can see those card holders grinning right now. So I want to know, am I alone in this, is there really anything bad about this? Or am I just insane?
Sub-statement: Some girl in the LRC is tossing peanut M&M's into her coffee...a lot of M&M's.
39 comments:
Thanks for posting, Mr. H - you still had 2 days on your exclusive rights...
I'm not touching this one (yet,) as I'd like to hear the feedback on this as well. I will say that the Mrs. & I decided that we'd give our kids the straight scoop on Santa H. Claus & Sr. Easter Bunny, & the Tooth Fairy, et al... we told them that Mom & Dad really fulfilled all of those roles - there was no mythical figure that came into the house with presents, choco-bunnies, or dimes for molars. It's not that we didn't want them to have any childhood fun, it's because when we told the kids about Jesus, we didn't want them to equate Him with the other (fake) holiday figures.
He's real.
i hate the neo santaclaus that fat-tub-o-jelly, every time my kids mention "santa" i say "that guy is dead, he died along time ago, you get presents from friends and family, don't give that dead guy any credit." why don't we invent a new character? because Jesus is enough, we don't need any 'old' characters either...stupid santa...now i'm angry
My take on the whole santa thing is this. First, I wouldnt do a xmas play. Second, depending on the role of santa & the context re: santa @ macy's, it could be not so big of a deal. I also understand the whole, what the heck is santa doing in a xmas play, @ church? It seems like many stray away from the most basic, Jesus, a cave, 3 dudes, animals, etc. Whatever is my response. I would like to see the script before I made a judgement on that one.
I actually read a book while browsing at a bookstore that traced the historical origins of Santa Claus. Complete with historical artwork illustrations. The author claimed that Santa was really "Old Nick" and that medieval legends about Satan included black boots, a cane, a bag, etc. It was pretty weird. (The author wasn't a Christan and wasn't trying to make the point that Santa rearranged spells Satan.)
I don't make a big deal out of Santa but I wouldn't put him in a Christmas play.
On the other hand, I don't know if there's a biblical mandate for celebrating Christmas. It wasn't mentioned in the Bible either, the way Passover and other Jewish holidays were. In fact, Dec. 25 was initially the holiday of Saturnalia which was taken over by the church when the empire became Christian.
But if a church is going to acknowledge Christmas, I think that a celebration of Jesus' birth makes more sense than Santa.
First of all, pretty much every play that I've ever seen at a church sucked it . . . big time. I've read the book; I know how it all goes. It's worse than regional theatre.
I don't think that Santa belongs in a Christmas play at church. Other than that, I've got no problem with the guy. I think that it's okay for little kids to think there's a Santa. Most kids grow up too fast anyway, so they'll figure out that it's fake.
I believe that it's possible to educate kids about "the reason for the season" as well as let them take part in all of the Chrismastime folklore (rudolph, scrooge, and Buddy the Elf).
If the purpose of the play was to spread the gospel, Santa don't belong. If it was to simply entertain and provide a venue for people to get together, I don't think it would be a problem, unless they were performing in the nude, of course. Like Murdoc, I would want to see the context of the script.
If one wanted to take the whole Christmas thing to an extreme, consider that we torture and sacrifice a living tree, put it in the center of our living area, adorn it with jewels and presents, and drop to our knees in front of it on Christmas.
BTW, I would draw the line at Santa serving the communion . . .
akay-here's where you are going to see some i agree, to disagree,agreeably. FIRST-Santa in a church play-I would have to see the script as above mentioned. I think a point could be made if written well. SECOND-I was told about Santa, Easter Bunny, Tooth fairy AND Jesus when I was a child and I figured it out,(by the grace of GOD) no prob. THIRD-This holiday we call "Christmas" is so far stretched from anything remotely identifiable anymore (or ever)that it makes me think that it is what we choose to make it or make out of it. Holidays in general can become a bit of an idol no matter who's the main character!!
Murdoc, your "Xmas" took the Christ out of CHRISTmas, and that offends me deeply...or something like that...
yeah, i'm actually bothered more by the use of the term "x-mas" than i am at the concept of having santa in a church play. the context is key as many have said before. if it starts out at the mall with kids visiting santa and then launches into the Christmas story - fine. if santa is the fourth wise man, then it's a bit of a problem.
i, unfortunately, have to agree with obi. the play will suck for everyone who does not have a kid, grandkid, etc. in the play. plays always do. why force an entire church to sit through something so your kid can look cute?
Especially if you're the only one who thinks he/she/it is cute.
You sound like a J-dub. But really I think a little of the same. I'm not a huge fan of norms and traditions myself.
Getting caught up in things that don't have eternal significance is life. Does showering have any eternal significance? No, but most people make a point of showering.
Also, "Christmas Pharisee" is probably the perfect term to define how I act around Christmas, as I force myself to abide by a number of meaningless rules to ensure a merry Christmas.
Christmas and Halloween are the only two holidays, in a secualr context, that I care about.
I am now enforcing a 'no mask rule' thorn. As long as you don't want people to know who you are, I won't allow them to read what you speak.
thorn is a person who wants noone to know who they are, while being a prick on other peoples blogs. Butt-thorn is pretty much a fag.
Sr. H & all interested.
thorn is now posting as mike.
Sorry, "mike", no masks for you either
Hey, why do we keep changing the subject to thorn when we have such a good convo going on without him?
On the subject of the original post, I also agree that I would have to see the script. But, another thing I am reminded of, partially by the idea of "Christmas" in general, and partially by the comment by double d about being offended (however jokingly) by the term "X-mas." The holiday most people celebrate is far from being a celebration of Christ--a celebration of American commercialism is more like it. But more importantly, early Christians did not set aside/observe one day in a year to celebrate the birth of Christ because they did it everyday. So if Santa's in church once during the whole year it really doesn't stop the fact that Jesus is ALWAYS there...
very good point jeni about everyday celebrating the birth of Christ.
It is true, but don't hate commercialism. People can be offended by just about anything, especially if they're looking to be. I seriously doubt that Santa will have a prominant role & will steal the show from baby Jesus. If he does, then me & baby Jesus will poisen his hot chocolate.
After that, me & baby Jesus will hunt down Nano Butt-Thornmike & hurt their bipolar feelings.
That is a very valid point Jeni, I'm pretty sure that Santa doesn't have a large role in the production. I guess I just get emotional about Christmas and Easter stuff, but it is always good to have both sides of the argument to keep it level and sane.
i like the new profile pic senor h
I used to watch The Tick in the old days, and of course, Ren & Stempy, and X-Men.
i liked the live action show with patrick warburton. i have it on dvd if any are interested.
If you like "The Tick," it's creators have a show on Cartoon Network's Adult Swim called "The Venture Brothers." It's far funnier. You have time for that, right, Brent?
Brint said he liked the live action show...
Shawn is going to see Stryper at lawlor.
Venture Bros is really funny, I didn't know it was by the same creator. That explains the huge blond guy that pretty much has the same figure as the Tick, exept he has a mullet.
Yep, Patrick Warburton does Brock Sampson's voice as well.
I think they need to change it from 7º of Kevin Bacon to Patrick Warburton. Seems like he's been everywhere. Puddy was a good character, and so was the Tick, I think they fit him well.
Don't forget Cronk from "Empire's New Groove."
I had the pleasure of seeing two of the episodes of the Venture brothers and the Monarch and the Monarchs Henchmen were my favorite.
i could never forget cronk. eng is easily the best disney animated film in quite some time. which leads to another thought: john goodman is a great sidekick, just can't carry a film on its own. maybe he'll play santa in your mom's church's christmas play, mr. h
He'll play Santa for your mom, Brent.
Brint, your mom is santa.
i didn't know santa was vietnamese. wierd. explains the chimney thing, though . . .
And the wierd costume and short people working their fingers to the bone making toys.
so has senor h got the record for comments now on this one?
I think so, and I think it's more legit, because the comments here were closer to being on topic... (Sorry pigmy... nothing personal...)
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